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02/06/2022 7:15 pm
Donald Butler, born August 21, 1885.
April 25, 1998 - December 27, 1998.
Claimed to be 115.
I'd be interested to see the research on this man.
diego and Sailor Haumea reacted
02/06/2022 7:22 pm
Donald Butler, born August 21, 1885.
April 25, 1998 - December 27, 1998.Claimed to be 115.
I'd be interested to see the research on this man.
A very interesting case. He appears to have deflated his age in mid-life because his wife was born in the 1890s, and went as far as to get a delayed birth certificate in the 1940s stating he was born in 1893. Then he reinflated his age but went a bit too far in the other direction.
02/06/2022 7:58 pm
@heatwave116 See my USA-file. His 1900 census supports 1885 and later he deflated his age.
02/06/2022 8:04 pm
@heatwave116 See my USA-file. His 1900 census supports 1885 and later he deflated his age.
Can you link your USA-file here?
Profile picture: Marita Camacho Quirós (1911-Present)
02/06/2022 8:11 pm
NealIRC's page on that has actually been brought back up to date about a month ago (thanks to my help), and it stretches all the way back to the 1870s:
http://www.nealirc.org/Gerontology/OldestMan.html
Technically it's not fully up to date yet, because it doesn't have Tomás Pinales Figuereo yet, but I figured that he'd want an exact date of death before adding him. He does know about the case, though.
We're pretty sure he died on 24 September 2020.
Profile picture: Marita Camacho Quirós (1911-Present)
Sailor Haumea reacted
02/06/2022 8:28 pm
NealIRC's page on that has actually been brought back up to date about a month ago (thanks to my help), and it stretches all the way back to the 1870s:
http://www.nealirc.org/Gerontology/OldestMan.html
Technically it's not fully up to date yet, because it doesn't have Tomás Pinales Figuereo yet, but I figured that he'd want an exact date of death before adding him. He does know about the case, though.
We're pretty sure he died on 24 September 2020.
Would you say that his case is as strong as Horacio Celi Mendoza's, documentation wise?
02/06/2022 9:22 pm
NealIRC's page on that has actually been brought back up to date about a month ago (thanks to my help), and it stretches all the way back to the 1870s:
http://www.nealirc.org/Gerontology/OldestMan.html
Technically it's not fully up to date yet, because it doesn't have Tomás Pinales Figuereo yet, but I figured that he'd want an exact date of death before adding him. He does know about the case, though.
We're pretty sure he died on 24 September 2020.
Would you say that his case is as strong as Horacio Celi Mendoza's, documentation wise?
Horacio's case is quite a bit stronger (baptismal + several midlife and late life documentation). Tomas has less evidence, but his baptismal record supports his claimed age.
Profile picture: Marita Camacho Quirós (1911-Present)
Sailor Haumea reacted
02/06/2022 9:23 pm
@heatwave116 See my USA-file. His 1900 census supports 1885 and later he deflated his age.
Are there any known photos of him? All I could find was an obituary.
Profile picture: Marita Camacho Quirós (1911-Present)
02/06/2022 9:28 pm
@heatwave116 See my USA-file. His 1900 census supports 1885 and later he deflated his age.
Are there any known photos of him? All I could find was an obituary.
Not that I know of, unfortunately.
02/06/2022 10:15 pm
NealIRC's page on that has actually been brought back up to date about a month ago (thanks to my help), and it stretches all the way back to the 1870s:
http://www.nealirc.org/Gerontology/OldestMan.html
Technically it's not fully up to date yet, because it doesn't have Tomás Pinales Figuereo yet, but I figured that he'd want an exact date of death before adding him. He does know about the case, though.
We're pretty sure he died on 24 September 2020.
Would you say that his case is as strong as Horacio Celi Mendoza's, documentation wise?
Horacio's case is quite a bit stronger (baptismal + several midlife and late life documentation). Tomas has less evidence, but his baptismal record supports his claimed age.
I'm assuming that Tomás at least has some mid-life documentation as well, right? Just trying to see if the case is solid enough for me to tell Neal to add him.
08/06/2022 12:24 am
@mendocino https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1nPoPTxlJ7gv4YTrrAuCxhbpTyLs3jZavAEay1eclLqs/
There are some small corrections to due in the list. María Mojica Torres has been debunked by us. We found her birth record and she wasn't even 108...even though the earliest census supported 1903 as birthyear (reason why we are suspicious about so many american cases...). There is Isabel Castaño Restrepo who should be added as well.
Sailor Haumea and Mendocino reacted
08/06/2022 1:57 am
@mendocino https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1nPoPTxlJ7gv4YTrrAuCxhbpTyLs3jZavAEay1eclLqs/
There are some small corrections to due in the list. María Mojica Torres has been debunked by us. We found her birth record and she wasn't even 108...even though the earliest census supported 1903 as birthyear (reason why we are suspicious about so many american cases...). There is Isabel Castaño Restrepo who should be added as well.
What about María Martinez (1900-2011)? That case seems solid...
And not on that list but another known case is Amparo Cora Santiago (1903-2016). Does LAS know of her case?
08/06/2022 7:41 pm
@mendocino https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1nPoPTxlJ7gv4YTrrAuCxhbpTyLs3jZavAEay1eclLqs/
There are some small corrections to due in the list. María Mojica Torres has been debunked by us. We found her birth record and she wasn't even 108...even though the earliest census supported 1903 as birthyear (reason why we are suspicious about so many american cases...). There is Isabel Castaño Restrepo who should be added as well.
What is María Mojica Torres' date of birth?
09/02/2023 10:51 pm
@mendocino https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1nPoPTxlJ7gv4YTrrAuCxhbpTyLs3jZavAEay1eclLqs/
Lillie Neff's 1900 US Census entry lists her as being born in May 1898 (certainly a typo) and as age 12. So, that part should be corrected in the file.
There are also a few additional records/documents that could be useful to add, such as Delphia Welford's 1880 Mississippi state census entries, her 1885 school census entry, and her 1892 school census entry. The last two items here allowed for the "younger sibling identity switch" hypothesis in her case to be debunked. The Delphia Welford born around 1876 really was the same Delphia Welford who died in November 1992.
09/02/2023 10:52 pm
FWIW, I can provide you with Delphia's 1885 and 1892 school census entries if necessary. Though your Google Docs file on Delphia Welford should already have them. BTW, would it be OK for you to post your Delphia Welford Google Docs file here as well? Thank you. (It's also useful because it contains research for her siblings and son, showing that age deflation was a common pattern in her family.)
09/02/2023 10:54 pm
@heatwave116 See my USA-file. His 1900 census supports 1885 and later he deflated his age.
His 1900 US Census entry lists him under a different name (Davis Butler), but in theory, this should not be an issue/problem if we will see just how many children in total his parents had in both 1900 and 1910 and see if we can account for all of them. This is how we were able to conclude that Tonpon (born in April 1898) is actually the same Gertrude Weaver who died in April 2015.
03/10/2024 4:35 am
@mendocino https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1nPoPTxlJ7gv4YTrrAuCxhbpTyLs3jZavAEay1eclLqs/
I have just sent you a request for access on a different, spare e-mail account of mine, Jimmy.
03/10/2024 4:40 am
NealIRC's page on that has actually been brought back up to date about a month ago (thanks to my help), and it stretches all the way back to the 1870s:
http://www.nealirc.org/Gerontology/OldestMan.html
Technically it's not fully up to date yet, because it doesn't have Tomás Pinales Figuereo yet, but I figured that he'd want an exact date of death before adding him. He does know about the case, though.
We're pretty sure he died on 24 September 2020.
Would you say that his case is as strong as Horacio Celi Mendoza's, documentation wise?
Horacio's case is quite a bit stronger (baptismal + several midlife and late life documentation). Tomas has less evidence, but his baptismal record supports his claimed age.
I'm assuming that Tomás at least has some mid-life documentation as well, right? Just trying to see if the case is solid enough for me to tell Neal to add him.
I believe so. Here is Tomas's tree entry on FamilySearch.org:
https://www.familysearch.org/tree/person/G8CW-QNC
03/10/2024 6:28 am
Donald Butler, born August 21, 1885.
April 25, 1998 - December 27, 1998.Claimed to be 115.
I'd be interested to see the research on this man.
Apparently his WWI draft card, if I found the correct one, implies a final age of 116 for him, with the same birthday, only for 1882 instead of 1885. He claimed the same birthday later on in his life, but apparently with an 1883 birth year.
This is a case where the 1890 US Census, had it actually survived, could have helped significantly.
03/10/2024 6:57 am
@futurist yes, that is correct. I was just responding to your point about the draft card.
03/10/2024 7:00 am
@futurist yes, that is correct. I was just responding to your point about the draft card.
Yes, I know that it wasn't his earliest document. Hence I was saying that it was highly desirable for his 1890 US Census entry not to get destroyed. But alas, we can't undo the past.
Darthular Garner and Elena Slough are two other cases where an 1890 US Census entry would have provided greater clarity in regards to them.
diego reacted
